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Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 1:38 pm
by Ross
That's true. And "TV landscapes" don't exist. It's just about trying things to see if they work. You could use the TV landscapes arguments to sigh wearily at the ridiculous idea of bringing back Doctor Who or launching a pro-celebrity version of Come Dancing in prime time.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 5:43 pm
by Cole
GarethR wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:it was possibly no surprise when the clueless people in charge threw New Captain Scarlet away 10 years ago
NCS was never going to take the world by storm (the original was hardly a blockbuster), and ITV was the only TV company in the world that bothered to buy it - everybody else passed.
In all fairness to ITV, they did give New Captain Scarlet a second airing during afternoon CITV (where it should have started), but I wonder if ITV would have behaved a bit differently towards the New Captain Scarlet had they acquired it a year later after the success of Doctor Who's return? As it was, to originally air it chopped-up into ten minute segments, during some puerile Saturday morning telly, was pretty insulting to any programme.
GarethR wrote:Let's be honest, the only Anderson show that the general public really cares about is Thunderbirds, and Anderson was never able to replicate its success. As soon as he moved to the more realistically-proportioned puppets, a lot of the mainstream charm disappeared.
Whereas I largely agree with that, I think that any conversation with anyone of a certain age usually goes beyond Thunderbirds and Captain Scarlet is usually well remembered and the Mysterons' voice is recalled. Personally, I think the charm was lost with Joe 90 because it was a premiss on rocky ground and only made it into the mainstream concious as a way of poking fun at people wearing glasses.

Anyway, I'm probably just biased as Captain Scarlet is my favourite Anderson series.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:50 pm
by thebeekeeper
GarethR wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:it was possibly no surprise when the clueless people in charge threw New Captain Scarlet away 10 years ago
NCS was never going to take the world by storm (the original was hardly a blockbuster), and ITV was the only TV company in the world that bothered to buy it - everybody else passed. Let's be honest, the only Anderson show that the general public really cares about is Thunderbirds, and Anderson was never able to replicate its success. As soon as he moved to the more realistically-proportioned puppets, a lot of the mainstream charm disappeared.
Many regions were even clever enough to air the show at 7pm in 1965
You're seriously trying to compare the 1965 TV landscape with 2015?
Did ITV buy NCS? They are the ones who would have licenced the production company to make it seeing as ITV own Captain Scarlet. IIRC ITV/ Granada were the ones who handled the international distribution of the show.
And it was a success from a financial point of view as it was sold around the world to other countries.
NCS was a similar project to TAG . ITV put the money in to make a profit from international sales. ITV don't usually spend millions on their CITV shows.

As for the tv landscape. There may be more channels but some things never change - hence the success of teatime saturday Dr Who which is an obvious indication that TAG may have been worthwhile to continue showing there for at least more than one episode.

Much of the current status of Thunderbirds has nothing to do with its original screenings where it was largely forgotten including 2 cinema films that flopped.
YTV didn't even start showing it until 1975 and Anglia didn't show a single episode for the whole of the 70's.

It remained in the sub conscious which is where it stayed until the BBC aired it around 1991. ITV repeats were as always filler often in school holidays.
Captain Scarlet was never as popular as TB yet a reboot of CS appeared 10 years before TB.

I would disagree that he never found similar success. The Protectors was very popular , gained peaktime exposure here and would have gone to 3 seasons had Faberge not pulled out shortly before season 3 started.

And while Space 1999 was not that big in the UK, once again not aided by ITV scheduling it did turn out to be one of ITV's best sellers in the US being sold to dozens of stations across the US.
But I digress.

The bottom line is that TAG was not cheap to make so why throw it away? Why the 8pm documentary? Why the 5pm premier?

I only watch Tivo these days so rarely catch ads and promos but I've seen a fair few for TAG which gives the impression ITV think highly of it but that doesn't add up if it's airing at 8am.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:54 pm
by thebeekeeper
Ross wrote:That's true. And "TV landscapes" don't exist. It's just about trying things to see if they work. You could use the TV landscapes arguments to sigh wearily at the ridiculous idea of bringing back Doctor Who or launching a pro-celebrity version of Come Dancing in prime time.
Yes , I think ITV should at least give TAG a few weeks at 5pm just to see what happens.
They may be surprised.
They can always take it off just as they often do with shows that don't deliver ratings quick enough.
It's certainly the closest thing they've got to Dr Who so they have nothing to lose , its not as if they have anything half decent to show at that time.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:34 am
by GarethR
thebeekeeper wrote: Did ITV buy NCS? They are the ones who would have licenced the production company to make it seeing as ITV own Captain Scarlet
Anderson flogged NCS around all the major broadcasters in the UK. They all passed, apart from ITV.
As for the tv landscape. There may be more channels but some things never change - hence the success of teatime saturday Dr Who which is an obvious indication that TAG may have been worthwhile to continue showing there for at least more than one episode
NuWho is shown in primetime, isn't it? Not "teatime".
It remained in the sub conscious which is where it stayed until the BBC aired it around 1991
What about the ITV revival which began in 1981? For some years after that, Anderson shows were regulars on ITV. As late as 1987 episodes of Scarlet were being used in Night Network, and Anglia used to run UFO overnight.
Captain Scarlet was never as popular as TB yet a reboot of CS appeared 10 years before TB
IIRC Anderson couldn't get the rights to Thunderbirds, but he could to Captain Scarlet. His real aim was always a Thunderbirds remake, but he had to make do with what was available.
I would disagree that he never found similar success. The Protectors was very popular , gained peaktime exposure here and would have gone to 3 seasons had Faberge not pulled out shortly before season 3 started
However popular it may have been at the time (and I doubt it was a blockbuster), the general public has largely forgotten it.
And while Space 1999 was not that big in the UK, once again not aided by ITV scheduling it did turn out to be one of ITV's best sellers in the US being sold to dozens of stations across the US
It was only sold into syndication because Lew Grade got greedy. It was such a phenomenally expensive series that they pretty much *had* to sell it to a major network, and a deal had almost been done with NBC when Grade upped the price at the last minute. NBC backed out, and neither ABC nor CBS deigned to step in, leaving ITC with no alternative but to sell it into syndication, which was a major loss of face for Grade.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:35 pm
by ctraynor
I know that was the case when Grade tried to sell Thunderbirds to the US in the mid-60s. Did he make the same mistake with Space:1999, or did the networks just pass on it anyway? I did read that ITC New York's Abe Mandell managed to persuade a lot of PBS stations to drop homegrown shows at primetime in favour of Space.. allegedly "effectively creating its own network".

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:50 pm
by thebeekeeper
GarethR wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote: Did ITV buy NCS? They are the ones who would have licenced the production company to make it seeing as ITV own Captain Scarlet
Anderson flogged NCS around all the major broadcasters in the UK. They all passed, apart from ITV.

Correct me if I'm wrong , but NCS was at least part funded by ITV ( perhaps through pre-sale) who owned the character and would have needed to have licenced it to Anderson.ITV are not unique in British Broadcasting in doing things wrong. Most UK channels don't know what to do with anything that isn't the same old dirge they dish out on a daily basis. So no surprise it sold well elsewhere yet ITV were not really interested in a show who's 40 year pedigree spoke for itself.
As for the tv landscape. There may be more channels but some things never change - hence the success of teatime saturday Dr Who which is an obvious indication that TAG may have been worthwhile to continue showing there for at least more than one episode
NuWho is shown in primetime, isn't it? Not "teatime".

Dr Who may be primetime now but I believe it was on no later than 6pm when it started 10 years ago
It remained in the sub conscious which is where it stayed until the BBC aired it around 1991
What about the ITV revival which began in 1981? For some years after that, Anderson shows were regulars on ITV. As late as 1987 episodes of Scarlet were being used in Night Network, and Anglia used to run UFO overnight.

There was no ITV revival of Thunderbirds . It was used in the same old filler slots that it had done previously - usually holidays and mornings and as ever nothing was networked ( until Stingray in 1987 (or was it 88?)
Scarlet and UFO were both repeated but neither had decent slots. The Night Network broadcasts were cut into 5 minute chunks apart from episode 1 and 3am for UFO is hardly a revival although some regions did air it in slightly better slots but it wasn't shown by STV or Thames/LWT and in all cases it was no different to the 70's where it was filler , either in the afternoon or late at night.



And while Space 1999 was not that big in the UK, once again not aided by ITV scheduling it did turn out to be one of ITV's best sellers in the US being sold to dozens of stations across the US
It was only sold into syndication because Lew Grade got greedy. It was such a phenomenally expensive series that they pretty much *had* to sell it to a major network, and a deal had almost been done with NBC when Grade upped the price at the last minute. NBC backed out, and neither ABC nor CBS deigned to step in, leaving ITC with no alternative but to sell it into syndication, which was a major loss of face for Grade.
Where does this info come from?
I've seen plenty of interviews with Anderson and others involved in the show and and the story I know is that the series was promised a network sale if Landau and Bain were signed. They kept increasing the money they wanted until Gerry was actually in the US to close the deal when they increased the demands again and he got permission from Grade to give them what they wanted but they still didn't get the network sale. I doubt increased salaries to the leads would require any significant price to the network.
This info is backed up by the Space 1999 Documentary and the Robert Sellers book on ITC.
At any rate , it remains one of the most successful because for whatever reason it was sold into syndication and it sold very well which is why there was a second series . Doubtful a second series would have gone ahead based on the ITV figures . ITV couldn't even agree on a network slot for what was the UK's most expensive tv production at the time.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:15 am
by GarethR
thebeekeeper wrote:So no surprise it sold well elsewhere
Sold well? Where, exactly? I can't find any broadcast information for anywhere other than the UK. It was definitely never shown in the USA.
There was no ITV revival of Thunderbirds . It was used in the same old filler slots that it had done previously
ITV brought the Anderson shows back starting in 1981, after a period of several Anderson-free years. I don't see how it only qualifies as a revival if they were networked.
Where does this info come from?
It's been mentioned several times in panels at Anderson conventions (I've heard Gerry himself explain it at least once, and Chris Penfold too), and I've also read it somewhere - can't remember where now.

Space:1999 was never "promised" a network sale, but Grade knew that he had to have star names for the leads if he wanted to get a network to buy it. The story about Landau and Bain continually upping their price is absolutely true, and perhaps that's what made Grade go for blood in his negotiations with NBC - unwisely, as it turned out.

Selling into syndication was a massive loss of face for him; the most expensive TV series ever made up to that point should have been on a major network. Syndication should be what happens *after* you've established a show on a network (and been paid network money for it).
At any rate , it remains one of the most successful because for whatever reason it was sold into syndication and it sold very well which is why there was a second series . Doubtful a second series would have gone ahead based on the ITV figures
The ratings for the first part of Year 1 were good enough for Grade to agree to a second series, but with the provisos of a major budget cut and the introduction of an American writer-producer - enter Fred Freiberger. And then, in late 1975, the ratings for Y1 in the USA collapsed and Grade actually cancelled production on Year 2. It was only after Freiberger and Anderson convinced him that the new character of Maya would rekindle the interest of American audiences that he relented and allowed production to recommence.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:17 pm
by ctraynor
Looks like Grade made the same strategic error selling to the American networks on both those big shows then, hiking the price too high on Thunderbirds and 10 years later with Space:1999. Interesting.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:49 pm
by Razor Eddie
GarethR wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:So no surprise it sold well elsewhere
Sold well? Where, exactly? I can't find any broadcast information for anywhere other than the UK. It was definitely never shown in the USA.
Space 1999 was big thing in New Zealand - Saturday nights around 7pm - with lots of promotion at the time of the first broadcasts.

A lot of the Gerry Anderson colour shows turn up in the NZ after school or Saturday afternoon schedules and several of those must have been repeats for me to have seen then; Thunderbirds was the most prominent but I recall Joe90, UFO, and stingray appeared more than one; Secret Service turned up at lease once as did Terra-hawks many years later; but I don't think Captain Scarlet got much screen time apart from a couple of "movie length" shows that shared the Friday after school slot for years alongside the Thunderbirds movies and double episodes of UFO.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:09 pm
by thebeekeeper
GarethR wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:So no surprise it sold well elsewhere
Sold well? Where, exactly? I can't find any broadcast information for anywhere other than the UK. It was definitely never shown in the USA.

Although not aired in the US I read it sold well elsewhere around the world which would make it similar to most other Anderson non live action series
There was no ITV revival of Thunderbirds . It was used in the same old filler slots that it had done previously
ITV brought the Anderson shows back starting in 1981, after a period of several Anderson-free years. I don't see how it only qualifies as a revival if they were networked.

I didn't say it wasn't a revival because it wasn't networked , I said it wasn't a revival because it was used as filler. A repeat used as filler in a variety of off peak slots without regular time slots or even regular days isn't a revival specially when it might not even appear at all in some areas of the country and with the show appearing on different regions months and even years apart. Clearly despite the show returning to ITV it didn't make any bigger waves than it did before . And when did it actually do that? When it got a proper revival via its first ever network screening on BBC2 which lead to the show being more popular than ever before , toys selling out in shops etc. A show can't really be said to have a revival when much of its target audience are not around to watch it .
Where does this info come from?
It's been mentioned several times in panels at Anderson conventions (I've heard Gerry himself explain it at least once, and Chris Penfold too), and I've also read it somewhere - can't remember where now.

Space:1999 was never "promised" a network sale, but Grade knew that he had to have star names for the leads if he wanted to get a network to buy it. The story about Landau and Bain continually upping their price is absolutely true, and perhaps that's what made Grade go for blood in his negotiations with NBC - unwisely, as it turned out.

Selling into syndication was a massive loss of face for him; the most expensive TV series ever made up to that point should have been on a major network. Syndication should be what happens *after* you've established a show on a network (and been paid network money for it)

Gerry categorically states onscreen in The Space 1999 Documentary and its also in the Sellers ITC book that a network sale was guaranteed if they signed up Landau and Bain which is why they gave in to their demands. As for a loss of face - I doubt it , How many ITC series ever sold to a US network? He was used to them being sold into syndication. Many aired long after the UK saw them.
At any rate , it remains one of the most successful because for whatever reason it was sold into syndication and it sold very well which is why there was a second series . Doubtful a second series would have gone ahead based on the ITV figures
The ratings for the first part of Year 1 were good enough for Grade to agree to a second series, but with the provisos of a major budget cut and the introduction of an American writer-producer - enter Fred Freiberger. And then, in late 1975, the ratings for Y1 in the USA collapsed and Grade actually cancelled production on Year 2. It was only after Freiberger and Anderson convinced him that the new character of Maya would rekindle the interest of American audiences that he relented and allowed production to recommence.
Gerry Anderson , again on the documentary , states that Maya was Freibergers idea and he did not like it or many of the other changes one bit which is why he had Freiberger credited as producer. Anderson makes it clear onscreen in front of the camera his disdain for most of what Freiberger brought in . He was very specific about his dislike of the Maya character. From what Anderson says it was ITC New York who were pulling the strings literally regarding where the show was going . By this time Grade was involved in his movie work - and that was the reason given for no Year Three as funds were not available.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 5:04 pm
by AndrewP
Loved it. Can't recall enjoying a show's debut so much in some time. Basics were there. Loved the visuals. Enjoyed the general mix of action and humour. Why ITV are p*ss*ng this away at 8am and not using it as a lead-in for the whole Saturday night is utterly beyond me. One of the best things we've seen on ITV in ages.

All the best

Andrew

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 5:17 pm
by drmih
AndrewP wrote:Loved it. Can't recall enjoying a show's debut so much in some time. Basics were there. Loved the visuals. Enjoyed the general mix of action and humour. Why ITV are p*ss*ng this away at 8am and not using it as a lead-in for the whole Saturday night is utterly beyond me. One of the best things we've seen on ITV in ages.

All the best

Andrew
Well the pilot went out between 5pm and 6pm, so they can always review it, but its a kids cartoon at the end of the day and they will get the nostalgic audience for the pilot but I'm not sure it would fit well with the usual ITV early evening audience.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 6:03 pm
by Bob Richardson
AndrewP wrote:Loved it. Can't recall enjoying a show's debut so much in some time. Basics were there. Loved the visuals. Enjoyed the general mix of action and humour. Why ITV are p*ss*ng this away at 8am and not using it as a lead-in for the whole Saturday night is utterly beyond me. One of the best things we've seen on ITV in ages.

All the best

Andrew
I loathe Nu-Who and others on this forum have suggested that's because it lacks wobbly sets and rubber monsters. On that basis I should be lamenting the absence of visible strings and cutaways of real human hands in Nu-Thunderbirds. On the contrary - I absolutely loved this "re-imagining" of the 1960s franchise. It's obviously made by people who are passionate about the original. The clip from "Stingray" (Titan's terror-fish) and the nod to the Eagle design were lovely touches. If ITV bury this away in their schedule then the network is run by idiots.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 6:13 pm
by AndrewP
Hi Bob :)
Bob Richardson wrote:
AndrewP wrote:Loved it. Can't recall enjoying a show's debut so much in some time. Basics were there. Loved the visuals. Enjoyed the general mix of action and humour. Why ITV are p*ss*ng this away at 8am and not using it as a lead-in for the whole Saturday night is utterly beyond me. One of the best things we've seen on ITV in ages.

All the best

Andrew
I loathe Nu-Who and others on this forum have suggested that's because it lacks wobbly sets and rubber monsters. On that basis I should be lamenting the absence of visible strings and cutaways of real human hands in Nu-Thunderbirds. On the contrary - I absolutely loved this "re-imagining" of the 1960s franchise. It's obviously made by people who are passionate about the original. The clip from "Stingray" (Titan's terror-fish) and the nod to the Eagle design were lovely touches. If ITV bury this away in their schedule then the network is run by idiots.
Well, while I love "Doctor Who" from 1963 right through to the present day, I agree with you 100% about the re-imagining. Back in the 1960s, Gerry, Sylvia and their teams were working with the best technology and most talented people in their fields to make the most innovative and iconic shows. And so are the new teams. Gerry's use of puppets was never through choice anyway. But I loved them. Still do. Always will do. Watching "Trapped in the Sky" for the first time at the age of 11 was gripping and exhilarating ... and still is. But the use of CGI in tonight's show was as cutting edge as Supermarionation was five decades ago. Some elements of tonight's show impressed me so much!

My imagination isn't as malleable as it was when I first saw "Trapped in the Sky", but - by goodness - "Ring of Fire" came to close to helping me recapture that feeling all over again. And I'm sure it must have done for a lot of the next generation of kids who tuned in tonight, and who - I hope - will be tuning in at 8am next weekend. It is for them. Rod Serling once wrote about us each having only one summer. I think I've been lucky to cheat that average a few times - but I wouldn't want it to be at the expense of those who should be enjoying their own summers. I just wish that ITV would let the family join in the fun when they clearly have a very well made product, crafted by people who understand and care, and not hide away something that's clearly such a gem and which could be such engaging viewing for an early evening family audience.

All the best

Andrew

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 6:45 pm
by Doom Patrol
I quite enjoyed it. But how many rescues did they pull off in the space of an hour? The animation seemed strangely hit and miss too. Generally good, but Lady P seemed a bit crude by comparison. Mixing it with model sets was by and large effective. But I did find my eye drawn to the unscaled water around the island on occassion. But then I suppose Gerry Anderson had the same problem.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:46 pm
by drmih
Just checked it out and it's solid fare for kids / young teenagers (at a push) but there's no way this is anywhere near family viewing - I remember the Ben 10 stuff when my kids were at school and it has that feel. Hopefully it will find an audience in the Saturday morning slot. I've got to say that I didn't like the Anderson puppet stuff when I was a kid but loved UFO and the first season of Space:1999.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:54 pm
by thebeekeeper
Having now seen it I can see why they're showing it at 8am and have to ask why on earth they felt this crap was good for 5pm.
This is as forgettable as the Lost In Space movie.
We won't be watching it in 10 years let alone 50.
Just one in a very long line of CGI kids shows that will come and go in a flash never to be seen again.
Will we have a 50th anniversary cd soundtrack of this? I don't think so

It doesn't matter how good the CGI is , the puppets were "real" in their own way and still look more convincing rather like CGI in movies. Older films with genuine studio sets , props etc still look better. Most CGI just looks fake.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:48 pm
by Simon Coward
thebeekeeper wrote:I didn't say it wasn't a revival because it wasn't networked , I said it wasn't a revival because it was used as filler. A repeat used as filler in a variety of off peak slots without regular time slots or even regular days isn't a revival specially when it might not even appear at all in some areas of the country and with the show appearing on different regions months and even years apart. Clearly despite the show returning to ITV it didn't make any bigger waves than it did before . And when did it actually do that? When it got a proper revival via its first ever network screening on BBC2 which lead to the show being more popular than ever before , toys selling out in shops etc. A show can't really be said to have a revival when much of its target audience are not around to watch it
Don't follow this at all: why do you think much of its target audience wasn't around to watch it during the ITV "revival"?

With regard to another of your points, my memory of many of the Anderson repeats of the early 80s is that while yes, different regions did their own thing and weren't all showing the various series "simultaneously", I thought that most of the shows were repeated in most of the regions in pretty consistent timeslots.

The key thing with the BBC 2 screening was twofold. Firstly, not only was it national but it was a much better slot than ITV could possibly give it - because there's no way those sort of repeats would ever be put on either of the two main channels outside of kids' TV hours.

Secondly, Thunderbirds was on-air somewhere in the UK every year from its first broadcast until 1977. Come 1980/81 it had barely been away, so for that reason alone, the 80/81 outing wasn't really a revival. The same would not necessarily be true for the other Anderson shows, some of which had been off-air for much longer, although they never generally had quite the same merchandising clout as Thunderbirds in the first place.

Thirdly, by the time of the BBC 2 broadcasts in 1991, the children who sampled Thunderbirds first hand in the 1960s were all now old enough to have families and I'm sure the more family-friendly 6pm slot on BBC 2 would have attracted viewers both old and young. The same children were also now occupying key positions both in television and the toy industry and would have looked much more favourably on the re-runs than those in charge ten years earlier would have done.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 9:29 am
by fatcat
GarethR wrote:It was only sold into syndication because Lew Grade got greedy. It was such a phenomenally expensive series that they pretty much *had* to sell it to a major network, and a deal had almost been done with NBC when Grade upped the price at the last minute. NBC backed out, and neither ABC nor CBS deigned to step in, leaving ITC with no alternative but to sell it into syndication, which was a major loss of face for Grade.
Oh come off it- getting a foreign made TV programme shown on the US networks was like climbing Mt Everest with a rucksack. Whatever the excuses- they were only excuses..The Avengers remain the first and last British programme shown on a US Network.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 10:58 am
by Kieran Seymour
fatcat wrote:The Avengers remain the first and last British programme shown on a US Network.
Season 1 of Merlin was aired on NBC.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:36 am
by JezR
A number of series before the Avengers were sold to American networks. In 1956 for example Adventures of Robin Hood was on CBS at 7:30 on a Monday and Adventures of Sir Lancelot was on NBC at 8:00.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:55 am
by thebeekeeper
Simon Coward wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:I didn't say it wasn't a revival because it wasn't networked , I said it wasn't a revival because it was used as filler. A repeat used as filler in a variety of off peak slots without regular time slots or even regular days isn't a revival specially when it might not even appear at all in some areas of the country and with the show appearing on different regions months and even years apart. Clearly despite the show returning to ITV it didn't make any bigger waves than it did before . And when did it actually do that? When it got a proper revival via its first ever network screening on BBC2 which lead to the show being more popular than ever before , toys selling out in shops etc. A show can't really be said to have a revival when much of its target audience are not around to watch it
Don't follow this at all: why do you think much of its target audience wasn't around to watch it during the ITV "revival"?

With regard to another of your points, my memory of many of the Anderson repeats of the early 80s is that while yes, different regions did their own thing and weren't all showing the various series "simultaneously", I thought that most of the shows were repeated in most of the regions in pretty consistent timeslots.

.
Any revival could be said to be aimed at the original fans , most of whom would not be around during the mornings or afternoons when the repeats aired.
As for consistent timeslots , since when did ITV show anything ever in their entire history in a consistent timeslot and the same day for 32 weeks?

Had it "barely been away"? The show may have been on somewhere during the 70's , for instance LWT showed it part of the year every year from 1970 to 1976 or 77 and YTV were showing it mainly because they never aired a single one until 1975 yet Anglia didn't show a single episode in the 70's. And I can't say I've spotted many other regions airing it beyond 1972 but I am restricted to the TV Times regions I have access to so may have missed some.

For me , a revival is something like it had on BBC2 in the 90's . The ITV broadcasts were just repeats shown in ITV's regular sporadic haphazard regionalised fashion and it was the BBC's nationwide screening that allowed the show to become a media feature that it would never have been when only being shown in certain areas

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:53 pm
by Mickey
thebeekeeper wrote:Any revival could be said to be aimed at the original fans , most of whom would not be around during the mornings or afternoons when the repeats aired.
It's a children's show. You might hope that adults will tune in too, but you're not going to schedule it for them. As much as anything else, it would be commercial suicide.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:00 pm
by Simon Coward
thebeekeeper wrote:Any revival could be said to be aimed at the original fans , most of whom would not be around during the mornings or afternoons when the repeats aired.
But if you think the ITV runs were aimed at the original fans, why denigrate them because they didn't boost sales of Thunderbirds toys? if they were aimed at the original fans, why on earth would they?

I watched all of Thunderbirds during its original run in the 1960s and I watched it all again during its 1981/82 repeat - it wasn't difficult. It was on Saturday mornings - in two separate runs, I'll grant you, but then it was originally two separate seasons. The slot was pretty consistent - 11am initially, moving to 10.35am. The second run started earlier still, but it wasn't bobbing about in the schedules all the while. In each run it was shown consistently - only two weeks were skipped, once because of the early start of ITV sport programming on F. A. Cup final day, and one because of a special near-networked Boxing Day schedule. I know that some regions put Thunderbirds and other Anderson shows out in less original-fan-friendly slots, often keeping them for weekdays during school holidays, which suggests that perhaps they aiming at the original fans after all.

I agree completely that the repeats were shown in a regionalised fashion but I don't think they were anything like as haphazard within that structure as you make out.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:19 pm
by Simon Coward
fatcat wrote:The Avengers remain the first and last British programme shown on a US Network.
You are kidding, surely?

As it had multiple seasons and so sold over multiple years, I'm not sure whether you meant "first and last" to mean "only" or to cover a short period of time. Either way here are some before and afters:

ABC: O.S.S., Danger Man
CBS: The Adventures of Robin Hood, The Invisible Man, Quentin E. Deverill, Jack the Ripper
NBC: The Adventures of Sir Lancelot, Fireball XL5, The Saint, Jesus of Nazareth

There are plenty more...

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:56 pm
by dprisoner
Regarding the air time, this was brought up on the Fanderson FaceBook group: Does anyone actually watch at time of broadcast these days? So being broadcast at 8am means it's available to watch whenever you want - including 5pm (if that's your preference).

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 6:34 pm
by Mark
Overnights, still remain the bulk of the audience, and I'm sure the advertisers care, too.

It's not as if they couldn't show it at the same time, next week, as the slot is taken up by two cheapo fillers, "Off Their Rockers" and "You've been framed", very odd decision.

It was interesting to see what they did with it, a half decent, if unoriginal storyline, no real tension in the (as usual) hurried rescue scenes, it was an interesting mix of CGI with model sets, though, Lady P didn't seem to have much to do, and wasn't well realised, and the music was the usual orchestral big sound, that sounds exactly like all the other TV show ST's, these days, and would be boring to listen to, on it's own.

Anyone catch the 'Behind The scenes' doc, on ITV 2, in the afternoon.?...wasn't bad, both Sylvia Anderson and David Graham appeared.

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 7:36 pm
by thebeekeeper
fatcat wrote:
GarethR wrote:It was only sold into syndication because Lew Grade got greedy. It was such a phenomenally expensive series that they pretty much *had* to sell it to a major network, and a deal had almost been done with NBC when Grade upped the price at the last minute. NBC backed out, and neither ABC nor CBS deigned to step in, leaving ITC with no alternative but to sell it into syndication, which was a major loss of face for Grade.
Oh come off it- getting a foreign made TV programme shown on the US networks was like climbing Mt Everest with a rucksack. Whatever the excuses- they were only excuses..The Avengers remain the first and last British programme shown on a US Network.
I agree with your sentiments although I believe one of Gerry Andersons earlier series was also sold to a network but offhand I can't recall whether it was Supercar or Fireball.

The Champions rather famously was aired as summer filler on one of the networks but only for 10 episodes

Re: Thunderbirds (2015) First viewing

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 7:39 pm
by thebeekeeper
Mickey wrote:
thebeekeeper wrote:Any revival could be said to be aimed at the original fans , most of whom would not be around during the mornings or afternoons when the repeats aired.
It's a children's show. You might hope that adults will tune in too, but you're not going to schedule it for them. As much as anything else, it would be commercial suicide.
If you'd been paying attention you would have spotted that I was referring to the original series which was aired at 7pm - not the new show