Clarkson controversy

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Richard Charles Skryngestone
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Clarkson controversy

Post by Richard Charles Skryngestone »

What are everyone's thoughts on this? Should the rest of the episodes be pulled? Isn't that unfair to Hammond and May? Etc.
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drmih
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by drmih »

Richard Charles Skryngestone wrote:What are everyone's thoughts on this? Should the rest of the episodes be pulled? Isn't that unfair to Hammond and May? Etc.
They haven't actually made them yet - there will just be the filmed segments in the can.

I really enjoy the program and the banter but think that the BBC have provided too much rope due to the popularity and cash involved. As all of the contracts expire at the end of the month they need to make their minds up quick or someone else will be showing 'Petrolheads' very soon afterwards. My gut feeling is that May and Hammond probably would stick with Clarkson as it's a good platform for them and see if the BBC carry on with new presenters.

Clive
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Clive »

If I punched a colleague at work I would expect to be sacked, not just suspended.

I love how the media howls over the most minor verbal infraction from one of our worshiped celebrities. But it is "political correctness gone mad" (according to one report I read today) when someone gets suspended from work for striking a work colleague.

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Ross
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Ross »

Yes, it is. The producer should've smacked him back and left it at that.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by ghughesarch »

Well, I loathe the programme, so nothing less than the public execution of all three presenters, their families, the production team, their families, everyone who has ever appeared as a guest on it and everyone who has ever been in the studio audience will satisfy me.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Razor Eddie »

Used to be a big fan of the show but this petrol head version of Last of the Summer Wine (which itself was a human version of "Wind in the Willows") is well beyond its best before date. Far to many lame offensive jokes being made by one of the three non-very-wise-men who seem to have bought in to the PR and can't be bothered putting any real effort in any more.

Clarkson obviously thinks he can do no wrong so why not drive off and do it somewhere else and prove to the BBC that his way is the right way; my guess is that he knows he's on to a good thing and starting anew would require some hard work and imagination.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Ross wrote:Yes, it is. The producer should've smacked him back and left it at that.
You would say that, yes.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

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ghughesarch wrote:Well, I loathe the programme, so nothing less than the public execution of all three presenters, their families, the production team, their families, everyone who has ever appeared as a guest on it and everyone who has ever been in the studio audience will satisfy me.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Spiny Norman wrote:
Ross wrote:Yes, it is. The producer should've smacked him back and left it at that.
You would say that, yes.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Controller 2957 »

If I was on the receiving end of an assault I'd insist on the police being called irrespective of who had swung the punch, where they did it or why they did it. He's lucky he's only been suspended. In any job I've ever had that would be considered gross misconduct and would very likely have led to summary dismissal.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Juswuh »

Ross wrote:Yes, it is. The producer should've smacked him back and left it at that.
The problem with that is that they're not equals. Should a big star be allowed to assault people in a subordinate position?

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by drmih »

So we're relying on a couple of sketchy newspaper reports to try him, not the BBC 'fracas' statement? I think I'll wait to see what evidence is put forward, as it could be 'pushing or shoving', or even 6 of one... The 'assault' wasn't reported to the local police, and only raised a few days later within the BBC. Last year someone in the BBC leaked the filming out-takes of the 'n*****' rhyme to the press, so someone has an axe to grind.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Cole »

drmih wrote:So we're relying on a couple of sketchy newspaper reports to try him, not the BBC 'fracas' statement? I think I'll wait to see what evidence is put forward, as it could be 'pushing or shoving', or even 6 of one... The 'assault' wasn't reported to the local police, and only raised a few days later within the BBC. Last year someone in the BBC leaked the filming out-takes of the 'n*****' rhyme to the press, so someone has an axe to grind.
I was having a conversation about 70s unions recently and I mentioned the tale of the BBC employee who was sacked for assaulting a colleague. However, the sacking caused the employee's union to go out on strike (story from the extra Strike! Strike! Strike! on the Shada DVD). One of the group, I was chatting with, said that the employee should have received a fair trial similar to a court hearing, rather than summary dismissal. This same person is now calling for Clarkson to be sacked.

I suspect that, because Clarkson is so 'Marmite', things like this are an occasion for people who don't like him to have a go. One of my friends went on Facebook today calling for the BBC to get rid but she emigrated to New Zealand over ten years ago!

PS: Another vote for James May from me.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Clive wrote:If I punched a colleague at work I would expect to be sacked, not just suspended.
Sacked just like that, without your management investigating the claim against you?

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Clive »

Scary wrote:
Clive wrote:If I punched a colleague at work I would expect to be sacked, not just suspended.
Sacked just like that, without your management investigating the claim against you?
If I had punched a work colleague, absolutely ! And it is the knowledge of that that stops me going around punching people. Would you want someone working for you who had a habit of punching people when he gets upset ? Would you want to work with someone knowing that if he loses his rag, you are likely to end up getting punched ?

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Scary »

Clive wrote:If I had punched a work colleague, absolutely!
Really, without any investigation at all?

If I went to a manager and said 'Clive punched me' you'd expect to get sacked there and then? Or would you expect to be kept away from work for a bit while they worked out if you actually had?
And it is the knowledge of that that stops me going around punching people.
I hope that's not the only thing that stops you punching people!?

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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Controller 2957 wrote:If I was on the receiving end of an assault I'd insist on the police being called irrespective of who had swung the punch, where they did it or why they did it. He's lucky he's only been suspended. In any job I've ever had that would be considered gross misconduct and would very likely have led to summary dismissal.
This.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Scary wrote:
Clive wrote:If I punched a colleague at work I would expect to be sacked, not just suspended.
Sacked just like that, without your management investigating the claim against you?
I don't think a lack of an investigation is implied. Clive said "if I punched a colleague.." not "if a colleague said I punched them..."
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by drmih »

Nick Cooper 625 wrote:
Controller 2957 wrote:If I was on the receiving end of an assault I'd insist on the police being called irrespective of who had swung the punch, where they did it or why they did it. He's lucky he's only been suspended. In any job I've ever had that would be considered gross misconduct and would very likely have led to summary dismissal.
This.
So perhaps the evidence isn't there or it's not that straight-forward. It's hard to believe it could be hushed up for several days if it was so blatant and in a hotel. The media went from fracas to smack / slap and then onto punch with no further evidence - if the 'insiders' who leaked vague details when approached by the papers had witnessed an unprovoked physical attack, why not dash to the papers then?

NB: It seems like there are a few witnesses coming forward now:

'It was more like a scuffle. But he did swear using every bad word you could think of.'

and another:

'When Jeremy Clarkson left he thanked us for a nice stay, and said, 'It's been really pleasant, apart from the obvious'. I would describe his behaviour as a child's tantrum rather than anything violent'.

and another:

"The producer was being blamed. Clarkson didn't hit him — but he did use every possible swear word you can imagine. He had to be held back."

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Re: Clarkson controversy

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Cole wrote: I suspect that, because Clarkson is so 'Marmite', things like this are an occasion for people who don't like him to have a go
Undoubtedly. People who never watch Top Gear and have no idea of what it's actually like are enthusiastically grandstanding about what a terrible human being Clarkson is, as if he spends the entirety of every programme being racist. And of course, it's now being taken for granted that he punched someone, even though there's been no official confirmation of this.

I don't doubt that Clarkson can be difficult at times, it goes with the territory of being a world-famous media figure, but I find it hard to believe that he would have gone so far as to swing a punch at someone he's supposedly worked with closely for 10 years.

The eyewitness reports that are emerging now, if they are real, seem to suggest it was primarily verbal aggression. If Clarkson deserves to be sacked for that, then so do - and so did - any number of household names who've ever been famous. Tom Baker springs to mind as someone who was notorious for his verbal aggression towards others when things weren't going his way.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by David Boothroyd »

Popbitch has a report of what Clarkson said - let's just say I wouldn't recommend he visit any bars in Dublin any time soon.

Meanwhile here's some polling results.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Nick Cooper 625 »

GarethR wrote:
Cole wrote: I suspect that, because Clarkson is so 'Marmite', things like this are an occasion for people who don't like him to have a go
Undoubtedly. People who never watch Top Gear and have no idea of what it's actually like are enthusiastically grandstanding about what a terrible human being Clarkson is, as if he spends the entirety of every programme being racist. And of course, it's now being taken for granted that he punched someone, even though there's been no official confirmation of this.

I don't doubt that Clarkson can be difficult at times, it goes with the territory of being a world-famous media figure, but I find it hard to believe that he would have gone so far as to swing a punch at someone he's supposedly worked with closely for 10 years.

The eyewitness reports that are emerging now, if they are real, seem to suggest it was primarily verbal aggression. If Clarkson deserves to be sacked for that, then so do - and so did - any number of household names who've ever been famous. Tom Baker springs to mind as someone who was notorious for his verbal aggression towards others when things weren't going his way.
The words "last" and "straw" spring to mind.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Nick Cooper 625 »

David Boothroyd wrote:Meanwhile here's some polling results.
The frequency of viewing numbers don't really tally with the series' audience figures, even at their best.
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Cole »

Interestingly, some are celebrated for being obnoxious arses. I think they get called Divas.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Doom Patrol »

It all seems like a lot of nonsense to me. The incident with the bridge apparently wasn't broadcast because of editorial discretion until somebody saw fit to leak it. And now they are rushing to condemn him for something he might not even have done.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

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It's going to be a very difficult one for the BBC. I'm certain they don't want to lose Top Gear, it's a hugely important show for them, but if they feel that whatever Clarkson actually did means they have to sack him, then TG will probably only last for one more series before a collapse in viewing figures forces its cancellation.

I suspect that they'll be hoping they can employ a Jonathan Ross-style sanction of withholding Clarkson's pay for the dropped shows, and then bring back the series towards the end of the year (which has been standard procedure for some time now), with enough time having passed to let the whole situation blow over.
The incident with the bridge apparently wasn't broadcast because of editorial discretion until somebody saw fit to leak it
You're getting your incidents mixed up. The leaked clip was the "eenie meenie minie mo" one. The bridge incident was broadcast as part of their Burma special.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Doom Patrol »

Yes, you're right. I'm not having a good night. :-)

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Roll ACR »

Summary dismissal isn't really the thing these days, due process has to be followed. I think he's a twit, there's no excuse (except mental illness or being a child) for violence. I've not thrown a punch since I was 13 and I hope I never do again, least of all over a trifling matter. It's a hugely popular programme, I can't stand it but my Dad loves it so I do periodically see it under duress.

Loved it as a child. William Woollard, Chris Goffey.....A quick search of YouTube reveals how crap and boring those old shows are nowadays. But for me the current incarnation is equally crap and boring.

The whole n-word, Falklands and now punch business are just tedious and puerile beyond belief. Fans shouldn't be deprived of their show, it's clearly popular. Perhaps it needs to find a new home on a commercial network that doesn't have the disproportionate scrutiny the BBC exists under.

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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Bob Richardson »

GarethR wrote:
Cole wrote: I suspect that, because Clarkson is so 'Marmite', things like this are an occasion for people who don't like him to have a go
I find it hard to believe that he would have gone so far as to swing a punch at someone he's supposedly worked with closely for 10 years.
Then it will astound you to hear that I've witnessed many serious altercations at the BBC including several which came to blows. None resulted in dismissal but some resulted in individuals being moved to other jobs. One punch-up was between a presenter and programme editor during a live broadcast. The floor manager and floor assistants separated them. It's not as rare as you suggest. Maybe Sports department was a special case...
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Re: Clarkson controversy

Post by Roll ACR »

Yes Bob's right, it's a high pressure environment and I've seen people properly incandescent over production matters. I heard David Frost called a "fuckwit!" by a programme editor and saw a director almost come to blows with another presenter after a cooking demo after which said presenter offereda sample of the food to another turn who the director didn't have a camera on and specifically told said presenter not to involve in the demo. Trifles, daft, immature, but for some, vitally important in that moment. I'll never understand it.

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